Hi - New Member

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Figital Figital
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Hi - New Member

Hi - Just thought I'd introduce myself and my interest here.

I'm a middle aged (when does old start?) guy based in Bristol. Not an experienced rower, but a long history of dinghies (British Moth, Fireball, Larks etc. (guess the era..)), windsurfers, and yachting (Wharram Narai).

I've been chewing over the idea of building another craft, both for the interest, and the exercise and have in mind a rowing skiff. (I have a FEW hours in fine boats - but don't want a shell)

The Annapolis Wherry is the most elegant looking design I've seen, but is quite spendy, and won't fit in my garage. It also appears to be only available in kit (whereas the Tandem is available as plans...)

The Snipefish has caught my eye - a litle shorter, and light. There was some thread here about fitting a sliding rig to this design. That seems to be a good solution for a shorter boat, did anyone have success with this?

I'd appreciate any help and suggestions for suitable options. My criteria (negotiable) are:

Build in garage - 16' x 8' (but I could gain a few feet in length by intruding into utility...)
Car toppable - ideally by 1 person
Sliding seat - or rig
Preferably plans ( I have access to CNC router - so hope to keep cost down from kit)
Stitch and glue (I have experience of ply from the Wharram, and GRP from the windsurfers)
Suitable for river use and possibly lake/ estuary (Is there anywhere safe to row on the Severn Estuary below Sharpness? Is the Wye accessible.? River Avon?....)
Cost is as always an issue - it seems that the Annapolis kit + rowing rig + oars + trailer would be £3k ish
Primarily for exercise - but might like to carry a passenger for a picnic very occassionally

I'd be glad to hear your views on the craft itself, and on the options for where it may be useable in the West Country.

Cheers
Geoff
BrianP BrianP
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Re: Hi - New Member

Welcome Geoff, a friend and I have been building a Snipefish very slowly, just when we occasionally meet up.



Looking through your list she meets some but not other requirements.

16' tick
low cost - tick, just two sheets of 5mm ply for the hull, about £30 for timber.
sliding seat - tick
car toppable - tick
plans say s+t but no panel sizes, so most build over a jig, moulds and use stringers. You could draw her in CAD and unwrap the panels. Pretty simple single chine build. Even Edwin and I managed it.
no chance of a passenger

Skin on Frame can produce a good boat for car topping. Dave Gentry has a free design called Ruth which has been fitted with a sliding seat rig. No passenger though.

http://gentrycustomboats.com/RUTH%20page.html



There are lots of expert rowers here and they will come along and give well based advice.

I reckon as a sailor, you might enjoy a rowboat which could have a rig for occasional sailing. I think the best design if that were the case would be Joel White's Shearwater. Not stitch and tape though.

http://www.woodenboatstore.com/product/400-058/joel_white_designs

A beautiful design inspired by the Shearwater is Clint Chase's Drake. He has CNC cutting files for her and would be keen to have a Drake cut and built in the UK.

http://www.clintchaseboatbuilder.com/6.html



She can row with two, carry a passenger and take a downwind rig.

The St Ayles Skiff is hugely popular with groups and Alec Jordon has created a smaller version again designed by Iain Oughtred called the Wemyss Skiff http://jordanboats.co.uk/JB/wemyss_skiff.htm

John Hesp, a member here, has a very beautiful Westcountry Skiff in prototype build just now. He is based close to you and plans to supply the boat in kit form. She is just under 16'.



So I have not quite exactly hit your spec, car top, S+T and carry a passenger, but a few ideas to look at.

Happy looking,

Brian


BrianP BrianP
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Re: Hi - New Member

Ok, here's a design which meets every item on your list. At 18' just within your length spec.

It's stitch and tape
panel shapes defined so could be hand cut or CNC
Car topable . Probably best to use a KariTek loader if loading with one person.
Sliding Seat
Can carry a passenger
Proven performance, designed by a very experienced ocean rower.

It's the Angus Rowboats Expedition model. Plans with manual and full size patterns are $169 canadian.

http://www.angusrowboats.com/expedition.html





 

Passenger sits in here.

Brian

Chris Waite Chris Waite
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Re: Hi - New Member

In reply to this post by Figital
Hallo Geoff; welcome to the Home Built thing

Suggestions? I 'dabble' in design and have just uploaded one I prepared earlier:

http://uk-hbbr-forum.967333.n3.nabble.com/The-Three-Sheets-Rowing-Skiff-td4026174.html

Any good?

Chris W
Paul (admin) Paul (admin)
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Re: Hi - New Member

In reply to this post by Figital
Welcome aboard Geoff,

A CNC is useful, but when you factor in transport and the time to program it I bet a whizz round with a jigsaw is quicker.

It's quite easy to draw out panel shapes from DIY plans, run a jigsaw just outside the pencil line then trim with a block plane. Stitching comes with the unique feature of "undo" - you can remove stitches in the wrong place and fine tune the hull until it looks right.

If you literally just want her for exercise stitch and glue is easy for beginners, but if you want a piece of floating Chippendale furniture take a different route.

There's no need to splash out on a 3K kit. £50 on plywood, £100 on epoxy, £100 on tools, £25 on paint plus rowing seat, fittings, oars is roughly the right ball park. There will be epoxy spare for the next build and the tools will be reused.

-Paul
Say NO to Brexit. Kick it into the long grass
Figital Figital
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Re: Hi - New Member

In reply to this post by Figital
Thanks to you all for your replies.

It's amazing the lines you can achieve from just a few panels of ply.

As a first off I think I need something fully 'designed' - Chris yours shapes are interesting, but I get the feeling there may be some tweaks to the build process more suited to a more experienced builder.

The 'enclosed' touring design looks highly functional, but (I'm sorry to say!) not very pretty.

These things take time - not sure if I'll get afloat for this season...

Thanks again
Geoff
Neville Holmes Neville Holmes
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Re: Hi - New Member

Why give up the sail?  Try an Iain Oughtred design. A Whilly Turn could be rowed and or sailed.  If you only want to row then the Acorn has a very classic line.  If you have stiched and glued then Lapstrake should not be a problem for you but may take a little longer to build if you have access to accurate stich and glue plans to cut CNC.  Look at the catalogue http://www.classicmarine.co.uk/boatsearch.asp
Timmo Timmo
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Re: Hi - New Member

The Acorn skiff rows like a witch but also sails. Iain includes a choice of Gunter, Lug and Sprit rigs in the plans. Mine's rigged with the Gunter rig and she sails very nicely. Rigs in less than 20 minutes. Best sailed solo or with a small passenger. Needs to be sailed through a tack because of her long straight keel and she's quite tender. Goes like a rocket on a beam reach and loads of fun. 

Why give up the sail?  Try an Iain Oughtred design. A Whilly Turn could be rowed and or sailed.  If you only want to row then the Acorn has a very classic line.  If you have stiched and glued then Lapstrake should not be a problem for you but may take a little longer to build if you have access to accurate stich and glue plans to cut CNC.  Look at the catalogue http://www.classicmarine.co.uk/boatsearch.asp

Figital Figital
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Re: Hi - New Member

Thanks - but both those boats are way to wide for what I have in mind.

I am interested in the exercise of rowing (I have just a few hours in rowing 8 and twin scull) and think I want a slim sliding seat craft.

Sailing with a small sail and heavy boat is not for me.

Also the weight of the Snipefish makes it attractive - I am fairly sure I could wrestle it onto and off the car by myself (any comments - I am fit but not massively tall or strong)

Thanks
Geoff
Chris Partridge Chris Partridge
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Re: Hi - New Member

Hi Geoff
Don't get too hung up on sliding seat rowing. For us middle aged types sliding seats are significantly more tiring especially when the knees and hips get less flexible than they used to be. Almost any boat can be driven along satisfactorily fast with a fixed seat. Also if you want to go for picnics you will soon find that a sliding seat gets in the way and prevents you from moving around the boat. If you aren't racing, a fixed seat is much more practical, lighter and cheaper.
Figital Figital
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Re: Hi - New Member

Brian has suggested the Salamander, from Angus rowboats.

It seems to fill the bill ideally. They are due to release the plans (and kits) in 4 weeks - so I think I may wait and see the launch of that.

Cheers
Geoff
Chris Partridge Chris Partridge
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Re: Hi - New Member

The Salamander is a great design and the Anguses tested it in the most rigorous way possible, by rowing a pair of similar boats from Scotland to Syria via the Rhine and Danube. My only difficulty with the design is that if you aren't rowing huge distances but simply hacking up the river or round the harbour, the lack of beam and the sliding seat mean you can't stop and stand up to get the weight off your baps every so often.
I have found that a fixed seat boat with lots of room to faff about having lunch and admiring the view fits my personal needs much better these days.
If I ever pluck up the courage to do my personal fantasy row round Europe (Baltic, River Neva, River Don, Black Sea,  Med, Canal du Midi and back home) I would get a Salamander for its speed and capacious hold.
Chris Partridge Chris Partridge
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Re: Hi - New Member

Sorry, it wasn't the Salamander they rowed across Europe - it was the Expedition rowboat.
I must say I rather like the look of the camper boat, which would do very well in HBBR tours. It appeals very much to my gadget addiction with all those bolt-on bits. Love the dining table that clips onto the outriggers.
BrianP BrianP
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Re: Hi - New Member

The Salamander is their 16' family rowboat that has has been on their to-do list for a while.

http://www.angusrowboats.com/salamander.html

Colin has now decided not to do the Round Britain Rowing race this year and get on with producing kits for his designs, and thus a first prototype for the Salamander has been produced.

http://angusrowboats.com/blog/2013/02/1801/

Quote "They say that boat design is all about compromise – if it’s good at one thing, it will suck at another. While this often is the case, we feel we’ve done a pretty good job of making our open boat do a lot of things. It has traditional good looks fused with modern design elements for speed and comfort. It’s perfect for those that want to row alone, and also ideal for those that want to bring along a couple passengers and the family dog for a picnic. Buoyancy chambers at each end provide additional seaworthiness, and the hull is shaped for stability and speed. All this, and it weighs just a smidge over 60 lbs."

They want a new name for it, possibly Oxford Wherry. Some pics here

http://www.flickr.com//photos/angusadventures/sets/72157632733294654/show/



So, stitch and tape, full panel shapes available, take a passenger or two. Cannot use too much ply, the Snipefish uses just two sheets, so perhaps 4 for this including the buoyancy tanks.

Brian
Figital Figital
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Re: Hi - New Member

Although it wasn't the Salamander they used for the epic trip they claim that the Salamander hull is 'based' on the cruising hull - so some pedigree there.
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