Ray Lancaster

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Nesting Ray. Nesting Ray.
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Ray Lancaster

Hello all,just like to introduce myself. I have chosen the user name of nesting ray. Why? because l intend building a 10' nesting dinghy, why a nesting dinghy? because l live in a small 2 up 2 down terrace house up north. I have no garage but we do have a decent backyard with a lean to conservatory. The boat will split in two which will be easier to store, also l have no room for a trailer. I have the plans for a stitch and glue spindrift 10'. From B & B boats in North Carolina. I plan to start building in the new year. I am now retired and need a new project now that l have finished my Meccano hammerhead crane. I am new to boat building but have worked as a manufacturing joiner for 25 years so l have all the tools and know what to do with them. But l have plenty to learn, hopefully from you guys.
Port-Na-Storm Port-Na-Storm
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Re: Ray Lancaster

Hi Ray
Welcome to the HBBR Forum. At last someone who is actually building a boat!
Keep us posted and enjoy the build.
Graham
Timmo Timmo
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Re: Ray Lancaster

In reply to this post by Nesting Ray.
Hi Ray

Just to add my greetings to Graham's. You bring considerable experience in woodwork to the forum, look forward to learning from it.

I used to live in a two up two down terrace on the outskirts of Durham many years ago, not a lot of room for boat building. Hope you've a garage or workshop somewhere.

Nesting is a great idea. Lot's of room for ingenuity and innovation too. Having played with a few folding, sectional and nesting designs one of the issues is speed of assembly and dismantling. Simply bolting together is relatively straightforward but it can take time and it's a shame to be detered from taking time afloat because it would take too long to assemble and dissassemble the boat. Chris Waite (Cee Dubs on this forum) adopted an interesting method with his two halved Octavia. Will be interested to see whit route you follow.

We all like pictures of builds in progress.

Tim.


Steve Brown Steve Brown
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Re: Ray Lancaster

In reply to this post by Nesting Ray.
           
         Hi Ray,

             Welcome to the HBBR. I like you have no place to
        build a boat at home [ no garage ].
             I have a 10ft x 8ft workshop and a 12ft x8ft patio
       [ both with no access to the road] where i make all the
        parts for my boats that i can. I even scarf together my
        plywood panels and store them in the house  [ very
        understanding wife ].
             When i have all the parts ready i take them to a barn
        which is 10 miles from home to assemble them. I have
        so far managed to build 2 canoes, 1 kayak and a sailing
        dinghy this way.
              I like you have just retired and i am looking to build
        a Francois Vivier design Morbic 12 in the same way.

              All the best with your build,

                                                 Steve.
       
                                                                                           
Port-Na-Storm Port-Na-Storm
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Re: Ray Lancaster

Excellent choice Steve, I look forward to seeing the Morbic, keep us posted.

Graham
David Bewick David Bewick
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Re: Ray Lancaster

In reply to this post by Steve Brown
Steve,

As you know, I am a great fan of Vivier boats.  I think the Morbic 12 is a cracker, so I will look forward to seeing yours.  Will it be ready for Beale?

David.
Alan Alan
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Re: Ray Lancaster

There are plenty of ways to join multi-part boats but one method I haven't seen used on a modern boat is tensioned wires. A few years ago at the Thames Trad Boat Rally there was a Victorian or Edwardian canoe displayed on which a tensioned wire (or was it one each side?) ran from stem to sternpost holding the parts together.
Nesting Ray. Nesting Ray.
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Re: Ray Lancaster

Thanks for the warm welcome guys, as for the connection fore to aft, aahhh l have a cunning plan, as they say in the trade. To be tried out during assembly, if it works out ok, l will attempt to post some photos, which will be easier than a fumbled explanation. This could very well take some time, if getting the Christmas tree lights to work this morning is anything to go by.  Cheers all.
Port-Na-Storm Port-Na-Storm
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Re: Ray Lancaster

Hi Ray
Me again, can we re-wind a bit here?
Your boat is going to be built stitch & tape, yes?

What is your plan for finishing it?
Will you tape the outside of the seams or sheath the whole boat?
Paint or Bright/Varnish finish?

I'm just wondering how much Filler/Fairing Compound/Wood flour you are going to need, and if it really needs to be colour matched.  
 
 
Nesting Ray. Nesting Ray.
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Re: Ray Lancaster

Hi Ports.
Have been watching and reading Sam Devlin and how he goes about things, as l am new to this malarky l am tending to follow his ways. The boat will be painted, with varnished gunnels and thwarts. And just as my mate Sam does l will be sheathing the hull. I am busy reading through most posts on this site and learning plenty, any advice from you guys will all be taken on board. Cheers. Ray
Port-Na-Storm Port-Na-Storm
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Re: Ray Lancaster

I think sheathing the outside of a S&T hull is probably the best way to go, much better than tapes which are either left showing or need to be faired out.
It does add a lot of expense and weight though which is why I normally go for Clinker Ply construction.

If you are reading through the other builds on this forum you'll have come across Chris Waite who loves to torture ply and does amazing things with poly-cotton sheets instead of glass.

Next question. What type of epoxy are you planning to use? I've used UK Epoxy  for quite a few builds and they provide an excellent mail order service, others have their own ideas and I know MAS epoxy is said to "wet out well" for sheathing.
Cheers Grum.  
Nesting Ray. Nesting Ray.
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Re: Ray Lancaster

Hi Grum.
Thanks for the UK epoxy link. Cheaper than West system. I can buy epoxy resin for what equates to £19.30 per kilo, from UK epoxy. As opposed to West being £32 per kilo. The only drawback being that with the UK stuff says lowest temperature to be no less than 12 degrees C. Whereas West have an hardener for 5 degrees C. As l will be building in Jan & Feb.this may create problems. I will be commandeering the lean to conservatory to build the initial stage of hull assembly, and will use a halogen heater as reccomended by West. Any thoughts on this procedure??  Yes l have read Chris Waite's epic saga, l thought the tesco poly cotton thing was a joke, do'es it really work? Also l looked on your blog link, is that your dinghy? A fine looking piece of wood crafting if ever there was, beautifully finished. Best wishes for the festive season t o you and yours. Ray
Chris Waite Chris Waite
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Re: Ray Lancaster

Hallo Ray

Using Tesco's polycotton sheets to sheath is for real.  I originally used some thicker polyester cotton on the decks of my little gaffer 'Tit Willow' as I had previously noticed that ply that is curved, (all right 'tortured'), across its grain eventually opens up even if epoxied.  Out In the Middle East, it was much easier to get hold of trousy material than glass cloth and it occurred to me that people used to waterproof old yacht decks by laying canvas onto wet paint.

Then on this site there has been all the conversation about birch (and other ply), rotting if water gets into the laminate, so I have started using it to strengthen and protect the surface of the wood outside the hull and in the cockpit.  It really does seem to work a treat.  I calculate that it's cheaper and lighter than using glassfibre mat, though it is a tad thirsty on the epoxy and a double sheet will go from gunwale to gunwale of a small dinghy.  It really seems to be working well so far - five years on my two part rowing skiff 'Octavia' and fourteen on the decks of the gaffer.

It comes out quite fuzzy, which is useful for decks that need to grip feet, but for a smooth finish, sand it off and give it another coat of straight epoxy over the top, then paint as you would.  I actually use two part polyurethane top coat straight onto the epoxy, no primer and it usually only needs two coats.  Then your pride and joy is sealed literally for years to come.  Again it works a treat if you can afford the initial layout.

Unless you are going for a crushed velvet effect

Iron it first

Chris
Paul (admin) Paul (admin)
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Re: Ray Lancaster

In reply to this post by Nesting Ray.
Ray,
In cold weather standard practice is to heat the joint for 2 hours, thats enough to start the chemical reaction.

For Millibee I used a fan heater on the lowest thermostat setting on a 2hr mechanical timer, throw a blanket on top to keep the heat in. That worked fine for dozens of winter joints outside. Infrared lamps are just as good.

That advice came from UK Epoxy.

Cheers Paul
Say NO to Brexit. Kick it into the long grass
Port-Na-Storm Port-Na-Storm
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Re: Ray Lancaster

In reply to this post by Nesting Ray.
Hello again.
I've used UK epoxy down to nearly 0 degrees and it does eventually go off, might take a few days though.
The famous Chris Perkins has reported from Ullapool that the St. Ayles Skiff builders are building in barns with sub zero temperatures at times.
Some form of heat is a good idea, I've heard of pig lamps and even old electric blankets being used.

One of the drawbacks of UK Epoxy and presumably any other mail order supplier is the cost of delivery. Epoxy is heavy stuff so delivery costs can make your eyes water, make sure you order everything you need in one hit.
I'd recommend getting the pumps to go with the epoxy, makes life so much easier, plus filleting blend for the joints etc.

Heed CW's tip to iron the polly cotton first.
I didn't when I sheathed Katie Beardie's deck so she has that rag-rolled effect which was so popular in the seventies.
Nesting Ray. Nesting Ray.
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Re: Ray Lancaster

Re. The poly cotton sheets, would you reccommend stripes or floral, l thought the floral easier on the eye, but a good effect could be engineered from the use of diagonal stripes, also it saves painting. Sorry guys l promise to sober up in the new year. Ray
Chris Waite Chris Waite
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Re: Ray Lancaster

I can tell

You're going to fit in very well here Ray

Chris
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